Discuss these critiques of the Pickens Plan
Hello all. I recently heard several critiques of the Pickens Plan that seemed sound to me. So I would like to hear from you a rebuttal to these points. (I am asking this as someone who is very enthusiastic about the Pickens Plan, but always interested in the "other side" of the argument as well.) These rebuttals come from the testimony which followed that of Mr. Pickens' before the Senate.
(1) Assuming that we generate the equivalent of ~22% of our current electrical demand from Wind, there is no mechanism by which we can dictate that the "freed up" natural gas moves to the transportation sector. For example, the Wind power could displace Coal instead - it really depends on the underlying economics.
(2) The United States only has about 3% of the world's proven and unproven reserves of natural gas. The nations that have most of it? It's the very same nations that currently have most of the world's oil. So is a dependence on natural gas actually any better, from the geo-political / security standpoint?
Thanks and I look forward to your replies.
(1) Assuming that we generate the equivalent of ~22% of our current electrical demand from Wind, there is no mechanism by which we can dictate that the "freed up" natural gas moves to the transportation sector. For example, the Wind power could displace Coal instead - it really depends on the underlying economics.
(2) The United States only has about 3% of the world's proven and unproven reserves of natural gas. The nations that have most of it? It's the very same nations that currently have most of the world's oil. So is a dependence on natural gas actually any better, from the geo-political / security standpoint?
Thanks and I look forward to your replies.
Tags: Pickens, Plan, Senate, criticism, debate, hearing
Views: 28
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Rexrino on -
I have read that California has undertaken a very bold plan to install parabolic reflectors to concentrate solar energy on sterling engines to generate electricity. Is this true?
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Permalink Reply by Debra Goldenberg on -
Maybe this is what you were reading about:
http://www.inhabitat.com/2008/04/10/mojave-desert-solar-power-fields/
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Permalink Reply by RAS on -
FLP is also doing Thermal Solar at 7 sites in the Mojave Desert
http://www.fplenergy.com/portfolio/solar/solar_plant.shtml
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Permalink Reply by Warner on -
The US has plenty of natural gas for many years to come. The short term idea is to go
to natural gas and transition to hydrogen/wind/solar energy as the technology becomes
available.
Natural gas is here, it's clean and there's enough for us now. The worst thing we can do
is to not use the resourses we have. If we improverish ourselves we will leave future
generations nothing to build on.
Let's go with the Pickens Plan.
-Thanks
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Permalink Reply by Dr Mark on -
Warner,
I agree there is nothing stopping us from buying a Honda Civic GX today and filling it at home with one of Honda's home use pumps. So we need to get that started right away; in fact my wife and I need to replace an old clunker and are going to a Honda dealer today to talk NG.
But by the time a few million people are driving on NG we will need to be thinking about displacing NG used for electric power (even optimistically that is 3-4 years away). Otherwise there is a danger that NG prices would rise and people would stop converting before enough of us are off of foreign oil (especially if OPEC makes oil cheap again).
There are at least a dozen things that need to be pursued simultaneously. My list would be:
1. Promote NG cars
2. Build some Fischer-Troph synthetic fuel plants (coal to gas)
3. Promote Series-Hybrid Plug-in electric cars like the Chevy Volt (preferrably with NG engines generating electric power)
4. Open up almost anywhere oil companies and independents want to drill (heck, they are horizontal drilling directly under Ft Worth TX today and no one even knows or cares since it's a mile down).
5. Put a tariff on imported oil to guarantee it never goes below $80 again (Saudis can pump it for $5 a barrel and could drive prices back down if they see their market drying up).
6. Build totally non-polluting wind and nuclear power plants to control demand on NG consumption.
7. If we make lots of wind power (over 15-20%) also build pumped storage hydroelectric plants to be able to store nighttime wind power for peak demand hours.
8... I'm open, what else sounds good to everyone?
Dr Mark
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Permalink Reply by Dr Mark on
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I'll tell you one thing Tom, gas prices have dropped 30 cents in the last 3 weeks and I can already feel America going back to sleep ("Oh only $3.70, wake me up again when it gets bad").
What are we going to do with such a nation of stupid sheep (lambs being led to the slaughter)? I'm afraid that by the time the PERMANENT crisis hits we will have no resources left to address it. Excellence, intensity and persistence are called for an the only place we see this in America today is on the Olympic team.
Dr Mark
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Permalink Reply by Bob Bancroft on -
"'ll tell you one thing Tom, gas prices have dropped 30 cents in the last 3 weeks and I can already feel America going back to sleep ("Oh only $3.70, wake me up again when it gets bad")."
I was thinking the same thing Mark!
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Permalink Reply by joey caddell on -
There are people willing to make changes for themselves, and people who just want someone else to do the changing for them. The big question is..... Do we do the changing for them, or do we let them wither away as they would naturally?
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Permalink Reply by David French on -
Tom, there you go again:
"I REQUEST THAT YOU RETRACT YOUR FALSE STATEMENT IMMEDIATELY or make a formal complaint with the appropriate agency for further investigation. I would love that you open the door for me to learn about you (who you are, etc.)"
More threats against anyone who doesn't fall in love with your product. At least you didn't whine loud enough to start making lawyer threats...YET.
Tom, since you are following advice to use this site for free advertising as part of your "viral marketing" campaign, I'd suggest you learn to deal with the criticism, or STFU and GTFO.
Tom, are you involved in the cultish "religion" based in your city? Your behavior reminds me a LOT of those folks.
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Permalink Reply by David French on
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"How would you reply to Rexrino falsely telling that Moment-O-Meter is made in China? If you were me, would you just let him disseminate false information in this public forum"
State that, as the inventor, that he is incorrect, and provide the proper information. If you haven't done so already, also place that information on your website as to the origin of the manufacture.
I will say though, as we had discussed before, in regard to slander and libel, an opinion is protected speech, but someone stating a false fact is actionable. I am nowhere near lawsuit-happy, but in your case, if you challenge him to provide proof of his claim, and you have stated the factual information, you likely do have a basis to pursue him to cease and desist.
The problem before was that you were bothered by people stating opinions (things like "I think your invention is too expensive", "I think the invention isn't needed", "I think the mileage claims are unrealistic", et cetera), but this is someone attempting to state a fact ("Your invention was built in China"), so that is a whole different ballgame. You might have a case to at least get him to cease and desist from stating incorrect facts.
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Permalink Reply by Paul on -
I was the one that accused Delor of making his 'product' in China for $6... Not because I know or even suspect that he is doing that, but because if he knew the first thing about his 'craft' he would have had a pallet of them made in China for $6...
What I said tis that he's 'marketing' a $6 accelerometer, using techno-babble, and that I feel it's a $225 rip-off. I said if her was selling it for $25 it might be a cool toy, but at ~$250 it's clearly a scam.
I further went on to say that just because he's too ignorant to actually get the thing made for $6 and he may have spent $250 does not make the device worth $248. He didn't like that!
What I can state as *fact* is that he has posted his nonsense on many many forums & group discussions, frequently drawing scorn and ridicule from other posters and members. Again, fact, not opinion!
He did also threaten me with legal action... as you probably saw. I had come to the conclusion that ignoring him was best. He keeps putting his own foot in his mouth. Priceless -
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Permalink Reply by Bob Bancroft on
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"The big question is..... Do we do the changing for them, or do we let them wither away as they would naturally?"
I wanted to respond to this point, and say simply this: there is a third way.
One of the reasons our politics have gotten so ugly in this country is because so many people have managed to convince themselves that they know something the other half of the country doesn't know. And that, because they know better, they have the right, or even obligation, to enforce that viewpoint on their neighbors.
That isn't how democracy works.
Democracy is loud, chaotic, sometimes much too slow, sometimes much too fast.. to paraphrase a wiser man, its the worst system in the world, except for every other system in the world. In other words, it is imperfect.
I fully believe that if most Americans understood better the kind of economic MESS we are in, they would be outraged and demand decisive action. I think most Americans are willing to make sacrifices, when they feel it is justified. And that is the problem with today - Americans are so disenfranchised with our political leaders that they are not willing - do not trust them enough - to make sacrifices.
That is why I support what Boone is doing, despite my deep concerns about certain aspects of his plan. He is leading by teaching people what this really boils down to and why its so important. He is reminding people that if you have a can-do attitude, you can certainly do better than we have been doing.
I do not accept the premise that our government must choose between ignoring problems and dictating behavior. There is a third way, and its called leadership.
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