Too busy to Blog

I know how my last few weeks has gone, Thanksgiving and Christmas come and gone, a new President in office and a business that is pushing through a fickle and depressed market. I for one have been slack on blogging on this site in the last month but have been knee deep in the movement. When I jumped back on tonight I realize I am in 16 groups, have 18 discussions and most of them have had little or no activity since I was last on.

Are we all too busy to blog, did we all go out and start doing instead of talking? I hope that is the case but I doubt it. Big oil is trying to do it again and we are beginning to let them. DO NOT GET COMPLACENT. Gas will be over $2 and then over $3 and so on and we will be busting our rear ends to get out of this recession and OPEC will do their best to keep us down with $75 a barrel oil. We are pushing the EPA, congress, local politicians and local media to not forget $4 gas and what it did to our economy. Sure the Wall Street scandals and housing bust are the main culprit, but for those that didn't have their life savings in an IRA account or don't own a home that depreciated 50% in the last year, gas prices are the lasting impression. When gas is $4 a gallon, airlines lose money, shipping costs more, which makes groceries cost more so for those people that live paycheck to paycheck and can pay their rent, they are the ones getting hammered by gas prices. Bernie Madoff may not have stolen their nest egg, but he has certainly tightened their nest.

NEVER forget $4 gas and if you don't agree with TBP, find something you believe in and have some passion. America began a recovery on Tuesday, spread the word.

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Permalink Reply by Jeff Smoley on February 14, 2009 at 11:08am: How much does that 1" thick tank cost over the tank used for propane?
How much does it weigh?
NG to diesel, no, but NG to propane or other gas that is easily compresses to a liquid would be better. I can see CNG being used to run generators rather than coal. Centralized production is usually more efficient. CNG can be piped to the powerplant, coal needs trains and/or trucks.
How much does it cost to make that hydrogen?
NG to hydrogen in bulk?
Both CNG and propane will explode if their storage tank is ruptured. CNG is under much higher pressure.
Propane as a liquid will drop in temperature as it gasifies. We need a real world test, two tanks with the amount of fuel to produce the same performance in a vehicle. Both tanks to the same impact standard.
Ignition source the same. I would bet they both produce a big fireball. Ethanol is a biofuel.

My main point is that it is not the fuel that is the problem, it is the vehicle that uses the fuel. 35 to 40 mpg is not good for the environment. Using the technology I mentioned would allow a much lighter vehicle. A diesel electric hybrid system is the most efficient we have TODAY. That is why our train systems run diesel electric. If the diesel is bio or mixed with alcohol or a NG sourced liquid, we have a solution that we can use as soon as the auto makers wake up. I can see a CNG/diesel (dual fuel) hybrid. If the vehicle is mostly electric and the IC engine is for recharging for long trips or high power requirements (hill climbs, trailer towing, etc.) then the CNG tank can be smaller. If you can drive for 300 miles before recharging and can recharge with a small diesel running at almost idle, you will have solved the oil import problem.
This ceramic diesel can run on CNG. I am not anti CNG. I would use it today if there was somewhere I could get it and if there was a way I could affordably convert my two vehicles (or trade them in with taking a bath that would ruin me financially).
I have seen a proposal for a Kevlar and carbon fiber tank for CNG. Supposedly stronger and a lot lighter than 1" of steel.; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Jeff Greene on February 14, 2009 at 1:32pm: We are close to being on the same page Jeff. We have a Diesel/CNG hybrid technology that has been tested in Argentina and we will be testing in Florida in either Q2 or Q3 of this year. We have a CNG conversion kit that would be less than the tax credit if they would ease EPA test procedures including tank and installation. The weight and size of the tank is a setback, we have looked at composite tanks but the economics are tough, would you rather pay $600 or $2400 for a tank. That is the the problem we are dealing with at the moment. Basically, we are looking at a cost of $3000-3600 per vehicle for a bi-fuel conversion. Again with change to tax code, 80% would be eligible for a tax credit but assuming they do not ever get there. Our first station is under contract, we expect the retail price of CNG to be around $1.20. Today you would be saving .80 per gallon. Assuming you get 20 mpg in your vehicle, you would have to drive 75,000 or 25,000 miles per year to breakeven in 3 years. These numbers change drastically when gas goes to $4 per gallon but you see my point, adding another $1000-1500 for a lighter tank does not justify the expense at this time.

Our early adopters are going to be high mileage vehicles, travelling 30-40,000 miles per year. That includes subcontractors, fleet operators, Miami to Palm Beach commuters and vice versa. We have over 300 letters of support indicating the supporter will convert. It is not always about economics, if you see the numbers on the Prius that fact is proven. I have people that don't want money going to the middle east, I have people that want to do their part for the environment, and I have people that are vain and want to do it to be different. I really don't care why at this point I just care that somebody does something besides talk about it. I sit in committee meetings where they vote to approve a planning initiative, what that means is they will hire a consultant, pay him $20-30K and wait a year or 2 or 5 to do anything. Politicians are going to work towards bringing jobs and money to their constituents, that was what we elected them for, to represent our districts. Government is designed to work slowly, this is going to be an interesting year....

Find me a field and full propane tank, a full gas tank and permission to blow them up and I will bring the CNG any day.

Regarding hydrogen, we are going to be working those numbers in Q2. I expect between $8-10 per gge. Until that number drops it will have to be blended with CNG. As you know with economies of scale comes cost reduction. If we have 1000 gallons a day of hydrogen, our cost drops about 300% today so we will get more efficient as we get more vehicles. Again, the point I am making is lets do something, even if it doesn't do everything it is better than doing nothing.; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Jeff Smoley on February 14, 2009 at 2:30pm: "Find me a field and full propane tank, a full gas tank and permission to blow them up and I will bring the CNG any day.". Sounds like something we need to send to Mythbusters.
Not full tanks. Not enough air. Tanks 5% to 10% full.
$20-$30K a year for a consultant is CHEAP!
How difficult would it be to make a dual (triple) fuel (CNG/Propane) / diesel engine? Slight modification to the programming of the computer. Right now propane is available. I just went to Walgreens on Commercial and 64th and they have propane available.There is propane available all over S. Florida. If you want, you can get a propane standby generator, propane tankless water heater, "gas" stove and run a connector from your main propane tank to fill up your car.
What the gas companies need to do is to look at the long range picture. The costs to install the previous equipment is outrageous! If only the rich (say 10%) of the population can afford your products and about 20% are potential customers, you don't have that many customers. If your product(s) were in the price range of 50% of the population and 20% are potential customers, you are way ahead of the game. 80/20 rule.
Yes, some people buy Prius and Civic hybrids, but the price keeps them out of the hands of the majority. Hyundai worked the other way. Start will a price people can afford and more and more people will buy when they realize you haven't skimped on quality. When I bought my first Hyundai in 2000, you hardly saw another on the road. Now there are so many white Sonatas that I often find three of them parked together in the same lot.

I don't think you can build a company on 300 customers in the tri-county area. You need at least 3 more zeros, 4 would be better.

Hope to see you next Tuesday.; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Jeff Greene on February 14, 2009 at 3:46pm: I look forward to meeting you. I always enjoy talking to someone that will share their opinion, too many people will agree with anything.; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Jeff Smoley on February 14, 2009 at 4:45pm: Yeah, that is how a lot of people in Washington got elected.
We need engineers in Congress, not lawyers, if we want problems solved.; ▶ Reply to This